Please consider registering

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —

— Match —

— Forum Options —

Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
You Are A Radical, And So Am I: Paleo Reaches The Ominous "Stage 3"
sp_BlogLink Read the original blog post
June 15, 2011
7:51 pm
Josh Clark

Great article JS, for "being tired" I think you've belted out yet another pearler.

If people are interested in the conspiracy FACT of Big Ag in America, check out the documentary Food INC. It outlines in detail what JS has mentioned in this article, including what grievances and roadblocks modern day farmers have to face. Whether its having their hands forced into certain livestock arrangements or being penalised for using copyright seeds which have naturally been blown onto their crops, it highlights all of these problems and more, the grief the end users absorb due to this level of corruption and misinformation from the highest level.

June 15, 2011
8:24 pm
Chris Sturdy

This is pure gold.

June 15, 2011
9:09 pm
CrossFit Peachtree |

[...] Article courtesy of [...]

June 16, 2011
1:48 am
Charles Shanks

Great article. I used to eat all of the so called healthy products and followed the Uk diet advice given. Working in healthcare I also had a weight loss program running for my patients. For the last 9 months I have been following a Paleo diet ( well 85%, cavemen drunk wine didnt they) and have never been healthier or fitter. I used to spend every afternoon and evening with a huge bloated stomach and felt sluggish. No more bloating and now full of energy. The weight program I now run for my patients is all Paleo based with a bit of Crossfit based exercise and they are achieving amazing results. When people slag me off for being on a caveman diet I just show them before and after photos and let them work it out for themselves.

June 16, 2011
6:07 am

This is a stellar article, I loved it on every level. Thank you for writing it. I am always so delighted when someone just tells it like it is all in on place.

June 16, 2011
8:52 am

In the article you linked previously about breakfast cereal, I find it interesting that McDonald's is attacked for advertising to kids, but the cereal manufacturers are not. Kind of makes me wonder who's funding the assault against McDonalds...

Speaking of laissez-faire free markets:

June 16, 2011
11:34 am
Peggy the Primal Par

Putting it like that makes me want to cry. You describe reality without a doubt. And well said. That was a nice read. I don't agree with you, though, that things will be ok for us. I think there are very few people who are willing to take health and happiness over addiction. It's so complicated. It's so difficult.

June 16, 2011
12:49 pm
Steven M. Platek, Ph

Well put and accurate. It certainly does sound heavy of conspiracy theory, but I very much like how you dispel that with the value argument. Well done!
I argue, daily, with people about this very topic. I teach at a college where there are "smart" people that, unfortunately, still are not smart about what they put into their bodies. Even some high power evolutionary biologists and anthropologists, presumably able to interpret scientific data and at the very least able to identify crap data and statistical manipulation, eat according to USDA.

What worries me the most, personally, is what happens to my son. He's 8 months old and people 1) completely ignore what we want him to eat (primarily paleo) and 2) act like we are doing him injustice... sometimes there are looks that make me feel like i've done something wrong. Then I look at the lil fella and he is the most active, attentive dude around.

I talk about Paleo diet all the time, sometimes sounding preachy, I am told, but I feel it's my responsibility as an educator to help people. I mean if we keep believing the SH**ty science of Keys then we are doomed to medical care for ever. Yes Rabbits fed saturated fat will die of heart disease... come on!

Loved the article!

June 16, 2011
1:30 pm
Halifax, UK
Forum Posts: 364
Member Since:
June 5, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

@Peggy: "It's so complicated. It's so difficult."

You are right! It is! The reason it is so is because we are so divorced from natural eating habits. I talked to my parents the other night and outlined what I'm doing and how excited I am about really looking at my diet and changing the things that need changing. My mother said ... simply, "this is how your grandmother would eat" ... "meals ... no snacks ... meat, fish and vegetables ... and would walk everywhere".

That's my grandmother! How have we fallen so far from the path in only two generations?

As I presented in my first comment, globalisation has been a big factor - having ALL food available ALL of the time has removed knowledge of seasonal produce; it's removed imagination around what to do, removed looking forward to food seasons. Furthermore, food has been channelled into narrower and narrower choices that we've found we have to supplement with beans, grains, pulses and so on. Food manufacturers are squeezing profit and designing our diets according to their bottom line, not our health and wellbeing ... and, controlling the media that tells us what is healthy.

I know YOU know this ... I'm just saying it.

It is a thought-provoking article, but there is work to be done to reclaim our natural diet. Taking the time to learn, to remember and to pass on, educating our kids, getting them practically involved in planting, sowing and reaping. Skills will be lost inside a generation and once we're helpless as a race, we'll be nothing more than a giant consuming herd.

Time to bare our teeth and stand out as human. Learn, remember and pass on.

Living in the Ice Age

June 16, 2011
2:43 pm

@Steven M. Platek - I am in a similar situation to you. When I stop my kids from eating handfuls of 'partycrap' I get a few glances from (usually sick looking and obese) parents. Sure they can try some - but I am aware this is trick-food...

A few times I have had the 'everything in moderation line' from parents, and if it has ever gone on to a deeper discussion I use the following example to undermine their confidence with current nutritional dogma (I have yet to hear a robust defense against it):

"Ask your adversary (let's call him 'Jim') what he thinks we should do to lose weight. If Jim is schooled in conventional wisdom, every answer you get will classify in to the following:

•EAT LESS food, and,
•DO MORE exercise.

Emphasise this categorisation with Jim. Now suggest the following scenario;

Imagine Jim were to invite you around to his house for a large, exotic and sophisticated supper. Jim will likely spend several hours in the kitchen preparing and cooking the food. Given this effort, Jim wants want you to 'bring your appetite'. What would Jim suggest you do to COMPEL yourself to EAT MORE than usual (and so do 'justice' to his culinary efforts)?

Jim's suggestions will likely fall in to one of two categories:

•Skipping a meal prior to the supper, or eating smaller portions in the meal(s) prior to the supper (basically 'EAT LESS')

•Go to the gym or for a walk or do some other exercise (to 'work up' an appetite). This approach is essentially 'DO MORE'

You should see the paradox here; the VERY thing Jim would suggest you do to LOSE WEIGHT ('eat less, do more'), is the VERY thing he'd recommend you do to COMPEL you to eat more ('eat less, do more')!"

Definitley time to bare teeth!

June 16, 2011
7:10 pm
Katie @ Wellness Mam

Another great article, as usual! I'd noticed that low carb and paleo diets are showing up in the news a lot more lately, and in a negative way. Unfortunately, I agree that things are going to get worse before they can improve.

June 17, 2011
12:12 am
Forum Posts: 2045
Member Since:
February 22, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline


Exactly.  For instance, the idea that we can indefinitely continue growing crops on the same land, removing them from the soil they grew in (taking their biomass and nutrients with them), eating them, and flushing them into the nearest body of water instead of recycling our "waste" back to the soil...and that continual application of petroleum-based chemicals is a workable long-term substitute.

Thank you.  I can't promise every week will be a blockbuster, but I will always do my best.


"It's a good thing I'm eating paleo, or else my blood pressure would be dangerously high right now."

I laughed out loud!

Phocion Timon:

I think they're two tentacles of the same octopus.


Humans are about 70% water AFAIK, so you have more than 80 pounds in you.  The trouble is that if you lose it, you die.

People tend to lose a little glycogen/water weight in the first week if they go VLC/ZC...but once you're depleted, it's all real.  I recommend people pay more attention to waist size (and other body measurements) than weight.


All powerful institutions need their subjects more than their subjects need them.  A government is nothing without subjects to tax and an army to enforce: people remain people regardless.


Thank you!  Please stick around, and make sure to look through the index for other articles you might like.  And if you want to support my efforts, buying a copy of my novel is the best way to keep updated and ad-free.


Anything sufficiently distant from the mainstream sounds like a conspiracy.

I try to write articles that explain what we're doing in a non-conspiratorial way, so you can forward them to others. I hope they help.

Dave RN:

Systems rarely "get fixed": they usually die because they've been outcompeted by better systems.  Continue to exemplify good health and keep that mindset: "I AM the new system."


[Splitting this into multiple parts because so many of you have important things to say....]


June 17, 2011
1:11 am
Forum Posts: 2045
Member Since:
February 22, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline


Don has ditched the label of "paleo" for personal reasons. That's fine, but he's tried to turn that into some sort of general indictment with some very shaky leaps of faith (e.g. "six fat statues means Late Pleistocene hunters were fat"...sure, just like Egyptian temple art means they were ruled by people with animal heads.)  I'm not going anywhere without solid evidence I can explain to everyone -- and that I won't have to take down and pretend it never existed when Chris Masterjohn, Stephan Guyenet, and Kurt Harris all tell me I'm off in the weeds.

Glad to see you back!


Absolutely.  Anything sufficiently outside the mainstream gets called a conspiracy.  The technical term, I believe, is "cognitive dissonance."

Crunchy Pickle:

Yes, it does.  Most problems get a lot simpler once you ask "Who profits from this arrangement?"  (Or "Cui bono?" if you want to sound erudite)


The rich have always eaten more meat, and the poor have always depended on the grains they farmed.  Back in the Middle Ages, the woods and other hunting grounds were property of the lord or King, and it was punishable by death to take game from them.

Today, the very rich are so far removed from the world you and I inhabit that I have no idea what they eat.  But as far as the public figures, I agree: they've fallen victim to their own propaganda.


Someday I'll write an article on the definition of a paleo diet.  (There is no "the" paleo diet.)


How is it that medical professionals are taught that tiny amounts of drugs have a huge effect, whereas huge amounts of food have little or no effect?


Thank you!  I certainly hope things are better in Australia...I can buy marijuana more easily than I can buy raw milk.


It's not exact, since raw grains and pork bellies aren't the only components of the foods in question, but the relative margins are illustrative.  I'm glad it's helpful to you.


Absolutely.  A cancer patient adds substantially to the GDP by requiring very expensive medical care.  According to every economist and government official, this is a good thing: look at all the economic activity we're generating!


Economics is more full of baloney masquerading as science than any other field I'm familiar with.  I'm glad you enjoyed my article!  Do stick around.

And yes...LTV is one of those "so close, yet so far" theories...labor is indeed a necessary condition to create value, but it is not sufficient.

[To be continued...]

June 17, 2011
2:34 am
Forum Posts: 2045
Member Since:
February 22, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline


Thank you! I would add "King Corn" to the movie list and Lierre Keith's "The Vegetarian Myth" to the book list.


I appreciate the support.  Pull up a log and stay awhile...there's much more to come.


I agree: not suffering the post-meal downtime is a major benefit of paleo.  And I'm glad to hear that you're treating people professionally...if we can just get about 10,000 more of you into the system we'll be set!


Much appreciated.  Thank you.


AFAIK the breakfast cereal manufacturers get attacked by national organizations...but since it's hard for local politicians to ban breakfast cereal or national TV commercials, they go after what they can, which is the McDonalds restaurants in their jurisdictions.

That's my theory, anyway.


There are hard times ahead, no question.  But none of us can fix the world: we can fix ourselves, we can help our family, and we can serve as an example to others.  Progress is the result of millions of individual decisions.

Don't compare what you've done against the world: compare it against doing nothing.  If you feel like the world is against you, remember you're always welcome here.  And based on my web statistics, there are a lot more of us than you think!


It's astounding that anthropologists can know the evidence, know the relative timescales involved, and still eat grains, isn't it?

As far as your son and dealing with people trying to feed him junk, respectfully decline.  "We don't eat that stuff."  When they ask why, ask them "Why do you eat it?"  Turn the situation around: they're the ones that need to justify their choices to you.  That's a much better start if they insist on pressing the point.


Specialization comes at the price of dependence, and dependence comes at the price of slavery.


That's a good way to deflect the discussion from ELDM into "Why do some foods leave me satisfied and some foods leave me still hungry?"  (i.e. the Chinese Food Paradox of "no matter how much you eat, you're hungry two hours later)  It goes back to my example that a Quarter Pounder has less calories than the average fruit smoothie at the mall...


Absolutely.  Most paleo dieters are relatively normal people in other ways, and many have never had the experience of being part of a group considered "fringe" or "radical".  I hope to contribute some preparedness to the movement, so that we're not caught flat-footed by the onslaught of blatantly false propaganda.



Wow!  Judging by the statistics, this is my most popular article yet...thank you all so much for contributing and helping spread it!


June 17, 2011
6:08 am
Carbs and Dairy and

[...] a healthy diet is “whole” grains (sorry, but it’s not a conspiracy theory – it’s a conspiracy fact), many people are loathe to give up grains.  And that’s fine, if – unlike me – [...]

June 17, 2011
7:02 am

Kind of off topic of the post, but I saw this today and thought you might like a little chuckle about progress. Especially since I've seen this topic mentioned over and over again:,0,1793814.story

June 17, 2011
9:51 am
Laws of the Cave

The more I read these kinds of articles, the more I want to just dip from America altogether.

China caravan, anyone?

June 17, 2011
11:29 pm
Forum Posts: 2045
Member Since:
February 22, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Good find!  Let's hope this is a sign that the end of ethanol subsidies is near.


China wouldn't be my first choice.  I think you want someplace either progressive enough to allow direct dealing with farmers, or corrupt enough that a small amount of money fixes the problem.


June 18, 2011
10:33 am
Glenn Whitney

Great - one of the best if not the best paleo oriented blog post written so far, anywhere. Congrats and thanks.

June 18, 2011
1:02 pm

Please don't forget the drug & weight loss industries!! If type II diabetics went paleo, they wouldn't need insulin (or at the least, a heck of a lot less). And there's billions being made off of weight loss drugs that don't really work.

I really wish someone would ask dentists about teeth and paleo diets. Mine was impressed!!! And he informed me that the design of our teeth say we should be eating meat!

Forum Timezone: America/Los_Angeles

Most Users Ever Online: 183

Currently Online:
56 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1767

Members: 5371

Moderators: 0

Admins: 1

Forum Stats:

Groups: 1

Forums: 2

Topics: 250

Posts: 7105

Administrators: J. Stanton: 2045